HomeHome  PortalPortal  CalendarCalendar  FAQFAQ  SearchSearch  MemberlistMemberlist  UsergroupsUsergroups  RegisterRegister  Log in  

Share | 
 

 Not much of an internal.

Go down 
AuthorMessage
Reginald Carl II

avatar

Posts : 281
Points : 6691
Reputation : 11
Join date : 2010-03-04
Location : Malaysia

PostSubject: Not much of an internal.   Tue Dec 14, 2010 5:27 pm

I've been inactive in TF2 for a few days/weeks, but that doesn't mean I don't know what's going on with the going-ons.

An internal doesn't mean main lineup versus KGTF2 (I was personally involved in this recently if you guys even remember), because everyone knows the odds. You're not kidding anyone with your lineup and your "balance", because frankly, you guys don't really need the training like KGTF2 does. As in, work together with the other clan members to create an equal learning experience for the other clan members.

Against near-impossible odds which the other "non-main lineup" team is aware of, you're driving away the competitive factor in the clan. I'm personally getting put off by this, and I don't know if anyone else feels this way, but I think it should be heard.

If you really need a TL;DR: More balance in internals, less of the main lineup, more of a learning experience instead of an ego-booster for the main lineup, and less of a demoralizer for the other members.

Seriously, this really needs to be fixed. I don't get the point of the internals if it's 1 round of getting rolled and another round of getting screwed over by balance.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
kigbariom
Admin
avatar

Posts : 727
Points : 7948
Reputation : -101
Join date : 2009-05-14
Age : 24
Location : India (I'm not Indian)

PostSubject: Re: Not much of an internal.   Tue Dec 14, 2010 6:47 pm

Q: How do bad players get good at any activity ever?
A: Play better players

The scrims help people not in the lineup more than people who are. Show up to one and you'll see.

/thread
Back to top Go down
View user profile http://pgtf2.forumclan.com
Reginald Carl II

avatar

Posts : 281
Points : 6691
Reputation : 11
Join date : 2010-03-04
Location : Malaysia

PostSubject: Re: Not much of an internal.   Tue Dec 14, 2010 9:32 pm

If you read it you'd know that I was in one, and it made me feel like crap for the whole day.

Point in fact: you don't get better by playing better players, you get better playing with better players.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Crimson_SoulZ

avatar

Posts : 82
Points : 6076
Reputation : 2
Join date : 2010-09-01
Age : 24
Location : Malaysia

PostSubject: Re: Not much of an internal.   Tue Dec 14, 2010 9:59 pm

Before everyone wants to rage at me for leaving suddenly earlier today, I HAD to leave because of these 3 reasons

1 : I am pissed off of being steamrolled the whole round
2 : My brother made me lose my focus that time and he wanted to use the pc
3 : I am that tired of playing games for what 3~5 hours non-stop without breaks.


The earlier scrim. Milk said that there will be some sort of "balance" but what did I see? After that medic battle you guys just went in without me choosing a proper team. I am forced to play with punch, farnsworth, irre, maniac and the 2 other guys. We knew we will lose. Punch and Irre tried their best as soldiers to push and support, farnsworth was an excellent scout even though he tried to stop you guys and I'm proud of them. After you guys won that you guys wanted to balance out the team. That time I was tired and pissed off that I quitted the game.

I'm sorry for being crazy but I think that the scrim earlier today was unfair and it is not balanced at all. I may be the younger member of the clan, I still need a lot of practice and all but please, even out the teams next time you guys have an internal or what not.

TL;DR: Steamrolled by the main lineups, less experienced members fought hard but still lost. I quitted that game because I was that tired. Main lineups need to mix with the less experienced in either pugs or internals
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Reginald Carl II

avatar

Posts : 281
Points : 6691
Reputation : 11
Join date : 2010-03-04
Location : Malaysia

PostSubject: Re: Not much of an internal.   Tue Dec 14, 2010 10:03 pm

Crimson_SoulZ wrote:
Before everyone wants to rage at me for leaving suddenly earlier today, I HAD to leave because of these 3 reasons

1 : I am pissed off of being steamrolled the whole round
2 : My brother made me lose my focus that time and he wanted to use the pc
3 : I am that tired of playing games for what 3~5 hours non-stop without breaks.


The earlier scrim. Milk said that there will be some sort of "balance" but what did I see? After that medic battle you guys just went in without me choosing a proper team. I am forced to play with punch, farnsworth, irre, maniac and the 2 other guys. We knew we will lose. Punch and Irre tried their best as soldiers to push and support, farnsworth was an excellent scout even though he tried to stop you guys and I'm proud of them. After you guys won that you guys wanted to balance out the team. That time I was tired and pissed off that I quitted the game.

I'm sorry for being crazy but I think that the scrim earlier today was unfair and it is not balanced at all. I may be the younger member of the clan, I still need a lot of practice and all but please, even out the teams next time you guys have an internal or what not.

TL;DR: Steamrolled by the main lineups, less experienced members fought hard but still lost. I quitted that game because I was that tired. Main lineups need to mix with the less experienced in either pugs or internals

This.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Got Milk?



Posts : 29
Points : 5933
Reputation : 3
Join date : 2010-10-03

PostSubject: Re: Not much of an internal.   Tue Dec 14, 2010 11:42 pm

Fuck your 'this'.

I said that we'd play a scrim and fix teams based on the problems. The problems were obvious. Sorry, Farnsworth, but your scouting was not 'good'. It was sub par, and not up to your above-average scout skills.

Before you cry about imbalanced teams, you had KIN. As in, 'fml' Kin. The dude 'kin' who played demo for the runners up in AFL4? Division one runners up, mind you, not shitfuck losers dropping out of division two like us. As in, of all the people in the server, you had the player who kicked the most ass.

Anyway. Regardless.

I said that after the scrim, we'd fix the teams based on problems. And we did. After you left (not rage quit, left...your brother wanted to use the computer, right?), we switched the hitscanners (Avery and bullz for Farns and that new guy Toro). Guess what? The other team won. If you stuck around, you would have seen sweet sweet glory of winning 5-1.

My point stands. If people didn't all leave, I would have switched either Ave or Bullz back for Farns or Toro, and we would have played the closest internal to date. It's clear to me that Ave and Bullz are a necessity for us winning any scrims down the road, they are beasts.

Kin would be a plus.

Once again, for all future TF2 internals --

1) Main line up on team red, last person who went spec is blu captain.
2) Main line up plays a scrim against the six best people in the server (as determined by the blu captain, aka pick the Kins first okay?)
3) Play the game until it's over, either a half hour or first to five.
4) After the game is over, evaluate strengths and weaknesses and balance accordingly. In today's case, that was hitscans for sure.
5) Play another game if people are up for it (which they should be if this clan weren't full of infantile rage monkeys).
6) See point number four.

This way, the main lineup gets to practice together and play well (we are very rusty right now, then again Asiafortress is ded), and after that all other members of PGTF2 get practice, and also we get FUN, EVEN MATCHES. All of that for the low, low price of (deep breath)

NOT FUCKING RAGEQUITTING
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Reginald Carl II

avatar

Posts : 281
Points : 6691
Reputation : 11
Join date : 2010-03-04
Location : Malaysia

PostSubject: Re: Not much of an internal.   Wed Dec 15, 2010 1:37 am

That's probably the way you see an internal working, but the way I see it, is an internal is the clan as a whole playing in a competitive environment, with balanced teams and good communication.

The problem is, most of our internals act as training, and not as an inter-clan competitive game. It's more of a recruitment reel than a fun environment.

There aren't supposed to be any "weaknesses" or "strengths" in an internal, seeing as, the way we're supposed to be running internals is a fun competitive-styled game we can all jump in and play.

My point is that everyone should have a chance to play, and shouldn't be treated as a liability or an advantage over the other team or the team they're currently on.

This isn't an attack on how we run things, its a complaint I have regarding the way we run things. I'm not saying scrap it or modify it to the point where it's hardly playable or fun for anyone, it's just change it around a bit so everyone can have a bit of everything: competitive play-style, good fun, good communication, whatevs.

Don't take it the wrong way, I don't hate anyone, I don't dislike the clan, I just think that we could run things a little better. Also, side note: impromptu scrims are kind of weird, and should be planned well ahead some times.

I'll put a cat for good measure, and a confused pig looking thing. cat pig
Back to top Go down
View user profile
kigbariom
Admin
avatar

Posts : 727
Points : 7948
Reputation : -101
Join date : 2009-05-14
Age : 24
Location : India (I'm not Indian)

PostSubject: Re: Not much of an internal.   Wed Dec 15, 2010 4:18 am

Sad
Back to top Go down
View user profile http://pgtf2.forumclan.com
Crimson_SoulZ

avatar

Posts : 82
Points : 6076
Reputation : 2
Join date : 2010-09-01
Age : 24
Location : Malaysia

PostSubject: Re: Not much of an internal.   Wed Dec 15, 2010 5:27 am

I'm sorry Milk. I am really REALLY sorry but my brother did threaten me for using the pc for a bit too long so I have to accept his decision. After all he is my older brother.

To be honest I don't want to fight anyone anymore. I don't care if you want to do it your way I just want to have fun in scrims with all of you. No matter what the situation really is. I am sure that you, Kig and Skeek can work out some kind of plan that will make all of us good instead of having a main line up every single scrim. Of course everyone have to agree of what you guys want to do and make sure all of us follows it.

Now that I'm in a good mood now I want to apologize to you Milk, Kig and everyone else who were playing yesterday. I hope we'll stay together the way it's meant to be.

ps : I really suggest that either you or kig or milk plan out an internal before asking people to join. Just like the BC2 scrim that didn't work. This way everyone (hopefully) are aware of it and can join it.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Bullz

avatar

Posts : 369
Points : 6761
Reputation : 11
Join date : 2010-03-08
Age : 28
Location : Jakarta - Indonesia

PostSubject: Re: Not much of an internal.   Wed Dec 15, 2010 8:18 am

that there is a conspiracy alright
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Got Milk?



Posts : 29
Points : 5933
Reputation : 3
Join date : 2010-10-03

PostSubject: Re: Not much of an internal.   Wed Dec 15, 2010 9:39 am

I disagree with the the following things.

1) Internals should be planned out well in advance. Trying to plan things often just leads to disappointment (like the the failure of a BC2 internal, which we couldn't play because the the squad rush servers were all full). I think if we have eight BC2'rs who want a BC2 internal, we should do it. If we have 12, or nearly 12, TF2 players, we should say 'anyone want to internal?'

2) We can either do a captain system or a 'main lineup versus everyone else' system, but either way one team is likely to roll the the other. The the parity in skill level in this clan is pretty wide, to be honest, and it's either going to be red or blu with a 5-0 victory each time. My advice is that if you are winning, keep doing what you do. If you are losing, mix it up and learn from your mistakes. Have you popped a single uber? No? Go kritz. Are your scouts doing anything? No? Go to a new class (especially heavy for last point defense, pyro if you are Bullz and can airblast like crazy, spy if you want to get one kill and one kill only on their medic or demoman, etc) if you feel you aren't doing anything. Two scouts two soldiers a demo and a medic is the the standard lineup because that provides raw damage (demo), two tanks (soldier), flankers and pushers (scouts), not because it's the the only way of doing things. Pyro on badlands mid for instance can run through the the outhouse and take out the the entire team because you don't expect it. ESPECIALLY if they have m1lk whoring up the the gunboats soldier, a pyro with airblast will destroy that loser.

3) Do not, under any circumstances, rage quit. Seriously. It's just...control your emotions, it's a video game, you are playing against older people with more experience in the the game and more experience in competitive TF2. Rage quitting robs you of experience, robs you of a post-game discussion, robs you of the the second and arguably more fun round where the the teams get mixed up...

4) There are always, ALWAYS, ALWAYAYSAYOAHS going to be weaknesses in internals, externals, upternals and downternals. In TF2 or any other league. Look at any TF2 league or pug and look how many games end up 1-1, 0-0, etc. Competitive games are about weaknesses more than they are about strengths, and I think that's what people need to realize. Realistically, you aren't going to beat the the main lineup in the the first round. You can put up a hell of a good fight and mix the the strategy up, but it's meant to be a learning experience for both teams, and serve as a benchmark for mixing up the the teams. The point is that those weaknesses can be patched up (has anyone ever noticed that I cannot aim, and rely entirely on tactics? Oh...you have. Nevermind.) with better tactics and knowledge of the the game.

5) My goal is to get the the ringers in this clan to the the point where they can put up an honest fight against the the main lineup. I am confident that where your skills are now, you could have beaten the the 'PGTF2' that we were when we first joined. If you guys want to get to our level of play, it's more scrims and internals and pugs, not less.

6) I stopped trying to make concise bullet points at number one, sorry for the the wall of text but this is waking me up for the the onslaught of work emails I've got to do. Time to run!


Last edited by Got Milk? on Wed Dec 15, 2010 12:42 pm; edited 5 times in total
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Got Milk?



Posts : 29
Points : 5933
Reputation : 3
Join date : 2010-10-03

PostSubject: Re: Not much of an internal.   Wed Dec 15, 2010 12:35 pm

By the the way there is a hidden message(s) in the previous message. If you get it, message me on steam for a secret prize.

EDIT: the the prize has been won. Try reading the previous post again and try to get the the secret!

EDIT TWO: lulcause realized the opening letter to each paragraph is IWDTMI, which is the well known acronym "I Want Danny To Milk It". Danny's prize is that he gets to milk my unfunny joke.

EDIT THREE: Skeek loses because he thinks the trick is that "[12:44:23 PM] Sockituum: You stopped making the concise bullet points in point 6, but you made it a point to make it a concise bullet point". WRONG. Also, JoDog...
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Reginald Carl II

avatar

Posts : 281
Points : 6691
Reputation : 11
Join date : 2010-03-04
Location : Malaysia

PostSubject: Re: Not much of an internal.   Wed Dec 15, 2010 12:46 pm

Got Milk? wrote:
I disagree with the the following things.

1) Internals should be planned out well in advance. Trying to plan things often just leads to disappointment (like the the failure of a BC2 internal, which we couldn't play because the the squad rush servers were all full). I think if we have eight BC2'rs who want a BC2 internal, we should do it. If we have 12, or nearly 12, TF2 players, we should say 'anyone want to internal?'

2) We can either do a captain system or a 'main lineup versus everyone else' system, but either way one team is likely to roll the the other. The the parity in skill level in this clan is pretty wide, to be honest, and it's either going to be red or blu with a 5-0 victory each time. My advice is that if you are winning, keep doing what you do. If you are losing, mix it up and learn from your mistakes. Have you popped a single uber? No? Go kritz. Are your scouts doing anything? No? Go to a new class (especially heavy for last point defense, pyro if you are Bullz and can airblast like crazy, spy if you want to get one kill and one kill only on their medic or demoman, etc) if you feel you aren't doing anything. Two scouts two soldiers a demo and a medic is the the standard lineup because that provides raw damage (demo), two tanks (soldier), flankers and pushers (scouts), not because it's the the only way of doing things. Pyro on badlands mid for instance can run through the the outhouse and take out the the entire team because you don't expect it. ESPECIALLY if they have m1lk whoring up the the gunboats soldier, a pyro with airblast will destroy that loser.

3) Do not, under any circumstances, rage quit. Seriously. It's just...control your emotions, it's a video game, you are playing against older people with more experience in the the game and more experience in competitive TF2. Rage quitting robs you of experience, robs you of a post-game discussion, robs you of the the second and arguably more fun round where the the teams get mixed up...

4) There are always, ALWAYS, ALWAYAYSAYOAHS going to be weaknesses in internals, externals, upternals and downternals. In TF2 or any other league. Look at any TF2 league or pug and look how many games end up 1-1, 0-0, etc. Competitive games are about weaknesses more than they are about strengths, and I think that's what people need to realize. Realistically, you aren't going to beat the the main lineup in the the first round. You can put up a hell of a good fight and mix the the strategy up, but it's meant to be a learning experience for both teams, and serve as a benchmark for mixing up the the teams. The point is that those weaknesses can be patched up (has anyone ever noticed that I cannot aim, and rely entirely on tactics? Oh...you have. Nevermind.) with better tactics and knowledge of the the game.

5) My goal is to get the the ringers in this clan to the the point where they can put up an honest fight against the the main lineup. I am confident that where your skills are now, you could have beaten the the 'PGTF2' that we were when we first joined. If you guys want to get to our level of play, it's more scrims and internals and pugs, not less.

6) I stopped trying to make concise bullet points at number one, sorry for the the wall of text but this is waking me up for the the onslaught of work emails I've got to do. Time to run!

Hurr durr.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
kigbariom
Admin
avatar

Posts : 727
Points : 7948
Reputation : -101
Join date : 2009-05-14
Age : 24
Location : India (I'm not Indian)

PostSubject: Re: Not much of an internal.   Wed Dec 15, 2010 4:48 pm

I don't have the time or the inclination to entertain these messages and requests. Lets just play TF2 and I will fix things with magic.
Back to top Go down
View user profile http://pgtf2.forumclan.com
Bullz

avatar

Posts : 369
Points : 6761
Reputation : 11
Join date : 2010-03-08
Age : 28
Location : Jakarta - Indonesia

PostSubject: Re: Not much of an internal.   Wed Dec 15, 2010 5:47 pm

quite quite,

from my point of view gentlemen, from mister Charles side some of his idea is right as in more scrims equals more skill level, fighting higher skilled people equals we learning from our mistakes, as in when i was a pyro i used to be a W+m1 pyro but i got sick of it, man up and learn how to kill harder or higher skilled guys either with tactic or cunning skills, but i do believe Avertyn do not need any training as i have seen his skills in top notch form, and yes you can trust me, quite quite.

but as a human being, it is in our blood for the will to win a fight, ( and yes i do agree that people who do not strive to win in a clan is i must say indubitably a dungus, because a clan is meant for competitive players who want to sharpen their skills in a sort of way ) we should take their idea for balancing the people, but i do agree that on the first round of an internal its PGTF2 vs KGTF2 Or if i may say main line up versus substitutes, und dann we change the line up as mister milks idea and mister Amier's .

what i want to see or suggest to the lot of you is, if you want something cleared up or something to talk about or something bulging in your brain urging you to talk about it to someone, i do must say tell it to the person straight ahead and in front of a lot of people or if you want you can have privacy and make a separate mumble channel

Not make conspiracies or if i may in bolder words *ehem*

" Making other people hate the person you hate " by any means necessary or if i may *ehem* sorry i must drink my tea

sluuurpppp, this is a nice arabian mint tea, yes quite quite
Spoiler:
 

because that could create instabilities in our clan hierarchical structure this applies to everyone.

if i may say good bye to the lot of you.

good bye, yes quite quite

because i must measure the friction of the sands of arabia to my newly invented sandboard

yes quite quite

Spoiler:
 
Back to top Go down
View user profile
LToro

avatar

Posts : 28
Points : 5791
Reputation : 1
Join date : 2010-12-14

PostSubject: Re: Not much of an internal.   Wed Dec 15, 2010 8:35 pm

So I was in an internal...and basically I did terribad. Yeah, I train Scout and Soldier and Spy, but mostly Scout and Soldier.
But I personally think I successfully did my job - ie Flanking the Medic/Demo several times, and such stuffs.
I still got alot to work on..anyone care to give me a review of what I did? On a scale of 1 to 10?
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Got Milk?



Posts : 29
Points : 5933
Reputation : 3
Join date : 2010-10-03

PostSubject: Re: Not much of an internal.   Thu Dec 16, 2010 11:29 am

If you are a scout, stick with your other scout (scout pairs).

If you aren't doing anything as a scout, switch classes (Pyro, Heavy, Sniper, Spy, Engineer -- NOT Soldier, Demo, Medic)

Also watch a few of the videos here to get an idea about competitive TF2

https://www.youtube.com/user/CommFT

Especially the matches on specific maps.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SAQjLUhC9Bg -> badlands
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0da5pcJueTg -> gravelpit
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bcwt8Mn6OCg -> granary
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Sponsored content




PostSubject: Re: Not much of an internal.   

Back to top Go down
 
Not much of an internal.
Back to top 
Page 1 of 1
 Similar topics
-
» GM Polyglot book

Permissions in this forum:You cannot reply to topics in this forum
 :: Clan Business :: PGTF2-
Jump to: